xbox gonna drop to £199

act of desperation maybe?

still, great news


http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/entertainment/new_media/newsid_1936000/1936791.stm


competition will now heat up

I got to get one of these now!

Originally posted by me1000uk
xbox gonna drop to £199

act of desperation maybe?

still, great news


http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/entertainment/new_media/newsid_1936000/1936791.stm


competition will now heat up

Act of intelligent marketing (cdcloner's post verifies that). You can't easily raise prices, but you can always lower them. If you sell something would you start with your low price or a higher one?

Marketing 101: Price your product as high as the market will bear.

Lesson 101: £299 was too much for an xbox

I don't see whats so intelligent about dropping the price of the xbox because it isn't selling well!?!?!?

Surely its common sense??

JAM

it is quite an early price drop having only been released a few weeks ago. It can't be doing too well.
I do think though sales are gonna boom quite considerably now. Should be an interesting next few months in the UK games sales.

I think Microsoft realised that the GC is going to have a price of £150 in the uk, so it had to take action.

I think i will get one soon as the price has dropped, Because micot will not drop the xbox so you can garentee loads of games for years to come, and technically its the best of the three.


or i might wait for the ps2 to drop its price

and i get two free games and an extra controller as a Thankyou for buying my console at full price before the price drop!

Thanx Microsoft................anyone seen Sony do this?
Give something back for FREE?

Its not a sign of desperation remember you get more goods for your money than the ps2 can offer all built in with no additional hardware to buy(dvd romote don't count as you have to buy a PS2 memcard,so the two cancel themselve out)

How long before Sony are FORCED to drop the price of the PS2 i wonder!forcing them to lose more money per console than what they intended too

Good move by Microsoft! i say..

Originally posted by JAMAL
Lesson 101: £299 was too much for an xbox

I don't see whats so intelligent about dropping the price of the xbox because it isn't selling well!?!?!?

Surely its common sense??

JAM

Err... Didn't PSU have a UK price drop (I assume the same company that doesn't want you to have your MP3s, dropped the price because they wanted to do the consumer a favor)? Certainly £299 was too much for the X-Box (hindsight is always 20/20 vision). But that is lesson 102. If you don't see what so intelligent about dropping the price, do you see any intelligence in maintaining the price? And surely common sense is intelligence.

It should have launched at £199.99.

The price drop is only for europe BTW..... The thing is how much would MS be losing now per console sold??? Sony have found a cost effective way of producing the PS2 which will lead to another price cut very soon maybe £130 ish. GC is cheap to develop anyway probably £100 by the end of the year.
Like Jamal said it should ahve lauched cheaper it's only when they realise that it's selling **** and have no games in the multiformat top 10 that something needs to be done before they follow sega's route out of the console war altogether :)

I don't think that Microshaft dropping the price was due to intelligence they had NO choice, the simple fact is that the xbox is selling badly (for now) and now the price drop has come hopefully sales will increase as sony having a monopoly on the gaming world would obviously be a very bad thing.

And too the coment about Sony not giving anything for free after price drops well did sony drop the price after 1 month?? also ps2 will be cheaper soon because production is moving to China and they have put the EE and some other chips onto 1 chip.

Regards

JAM

Originally posted by Borgy
It should have launched at £199.99.

The thing is how much would MS be losing now per console sold???

I don't think Bill Gates is gonna worry to much,how much does he lose to pirated software for his OS.

Billions

I went into EB yesterday,they have two full shelves of 2nd hand PS2 games,all the crap titles that kiddies had brought,this is why the ps2 is doing well,it floods the market with crap.


go figure.


It certainly makes things more interesting,remember Microsoft isn't Sega who was in debt before they even brought out the lovely DC to the public.

I had a ps2 with about 200 games,out of them 200 games i played about 5 games.
Now i have a x-box with 5 orginal games,and i can safely say that i played the x-box more in the time its been released than the year i had when i had the PS2.

Originally posted by JAMAL

And too the coment about Sony not giving anything for free after price drops well did sony drop the price after 1 month??

JAM

No,i admit that,but when you see what you get machine vs machine and the addons needed for the ps2........harddrive/modem/ ect,ect for FUTURE gaming.who's the one that loses out in the end?

Not me,mines all included

Microsoft can charge as little as they like for the xbox. Microsoft is such a big comany, they can easily afford to lose money on production of consoles. They are obviously interested in profit, but their main concern for now is breaking into the market, getting established and then destroying the competition. Xbox might go on making a loss for the remainder of its life, but with Bill Gates in charge, it will never be dropped (like the dreamcast).

I'm sure we've all heard the story about Bill Gates and the golf course. A prestigious golf course wouldnt lett 'old Bill' play as he didnt have the right dress code. So, in a wonderful moment of rage, Mr Gates decided to build a luxary Golf course/centre in the near vicinity of the golf course in question.

If Bill Gates is that spiteful about being turned away from a golf coursde - imagine what he's gonna do to Sony and Nintendo !!

Sony are the main player in the console market, They have built up a household name over the last few years, Microsoft are trying to get a foothold in this market.
There is know doubting the quality of the xbox against the PS2, but its very difficult to come into a saturated market selling your console at £299, when your competitors machine is £100 cheaper.
Microsoft marketed there machine for the older gamer, but I think we realise that the money is made from younger gamers.
We know Sony bring out a lot of below par games, they have been doing this for a long time.
You have to hand it to the SONY marketing & planning department, they have made machine what it is, a name everybody knows. They always seem to have an ace up there sleeve at the right time. They have made Playstation "No.1" blowing away anyone who stands in there way & made it the first name that comes to mind if you mention "computer games console".
I have an Xbox & PS2, I like both. The XBOX is a fine machine & look forward to it meeting its capabilities in the near future. The PS2 has bought out some great titles recently & seems to go from strength to strength.
The Xbox coming down in price is a good thing, you need these challenges in the console market, otherwise companies like Sony become Complacent & are not continually pushed on to better things. Its good for a bit of healthy competition especially for he consumer.
Both machines are great & meet a gamers needs.

Its good to see competition in the games market but even microsoft had to admit that sales were below their estimations

...it's funny how a simple press release from Sony can make people make wild assumptions such as..."the price of the PS2 will drop drastically due to the integrated chip technology"...

...get real :D...these are the same people that gave you 2 controller ports!...the same people who short-stocked the U.S. on consoles b/c they could make an extra $100 by selling them in Japan!...and they're the same ones who just sold another million consoles in the time the X-Box launched overseas...at their current market price ;)...sorry to say but so far, Sony has been living off the "Playstation" name and far too much at that...

...just as the Saturn led to the eventual demise of the Dreamcast, the original Playstation led to the success of the PS2...developers openly show their hatred for the machine and consumers are becoming unsettled with Sony's online plans and their introduction of the hard-drive...there are (finally) a decent selection of quality games available for it, but seriously...for you guys across the pond who have yet to check out the X-Box, it's only a genre or two short of having a great game in every category...

Action/FPS: Halo
Driving/Sim: Rallisport Challenge, PGR
Platforming: Oddworld
Sports: Sega 2K2 series, Microsoft sports series, EA...

...I don't know about you, but I purchased the PS2 several months into it's life and there were no where near as many quality games for that console at the time...the console's only 5 months old!!!...and not only do you NOT have to worry about going online (if you have broadband) and buying an expensive add-on hard-drive, you get a console that's guaranteed more than a few more blockbusters in its lifespan....

...I don't see this as an act of desperation move at all...this is business, pure and simple...as it was said before, did Sony offer you a free game or controller when they dropped the U.K. price?...

jags

Do any of you think that it has put out a bad message dropping the price so quickly? will it put people off buying it in fear of ending up with another "dreamcast"?

JAM

We Really Are Spoilt For Choice Ain't We...

On The Left Is A Brand New Box From Ms With The Capability To Blow Any Other Console Away At The Mo...

On The Right Is A Machine From Sony That Is Just Begining To Come Into Its Own With Quality Games...

And In The Middle Is The Gamecube, Which Also Promises Great Things...

Now All We Need Is A Really Good Price War So That We Can Buy All Of Em, And It Looks Like MS May Just Have Started That...

Lets Just Hope The Backdoors Are Also Left Unlocked ;o)...

Originally posted by JAMAL
Do any of you think that it has put out a bad message dropping the price so quickly? will it put people off buying it in fear of ending up with another "dreamcast"?

JAM

Nope,no fear of that,there is alot of interest in the x-box but at the price it was it WAS putting alot of people off.Now microsoft relise this and have sensible lowered the price to match the other two AND not forgetting the people who supported it and brought it on release day by offering 2 free games and a extra controller.

I expect a announcement will be heard from Sony will be soon saying that the X-box is failing thats why the price drop ect/ect,and then go and drop the price of its PS2 to around £175.

This is good for all of us in the long run and keeps Sony on their toes,never before has Sony had to really go up against 2 new consoles who both have 3rd party support and console only exclusive's

The only bad message would have been for Microsoft to lower the price below PS2's. This would be targeting the low price market that GameCube must deal with. X-Box is still the premium product in the US and can afford to drop prices in other markets. Furthermore since Sony is the market leader, they are the ones restricted to pricing above costs by the FTC and other related agencies. Microsoft can offer rebates, incentives and if necessary drop prices to all but give away X-Boxes to gain market share.

If you think integrated chip price drops will enable Sony to drop prices, Microsoft which uses more generic components will benefit even more from this. The fact is neither Sony nor Microsoft wants a price war (and Nintendo wants one even less since they have less room to drop). I would suggest however, that Microsoft is best equipped to sustain a price war.

Believe me MS may have the money but the console will Never be even half as popular as the PS2. I ask people at work what console are they getting either for their use or their childs use and everytime it's PS2. And why you ask????

Because it's got the widest range of games available. Suits ALL ages. Can be chipped. Plays DVDs out of the box and has games such as:

MGS2
GTA3
GT3
ICO
Maximo
SSX Tricky
TH3
FFX
Pro Evolution Soccer
ISS series
LMA manager 2002
Virtua Fighter 4
Tekken Series
Soul Calibur 2 (on the way)
MOH: Frontline

could name loads more but would hate to fill this page :)

Also when the PS2 launched Sony didn't need to drop the price basically because it was selling a whole lot better than the XBOX was at the same price!

It will finish like this:

1)PS2
2)GC
3)XBOX

Originally posted by JAMAL
I don't think that Microshaft dropping the price was due to intelligence they had NO choice, the simple fact is that the xbox is selling badly (for now) and now the price drop has come hopefully sales will increase as sony having a monopoly on the gaming world would obviously be a very bad thing.

And too the coment about Sony not giving anything for free after price drops well did sony drop the price after 1 month?? also ps2 will be cheaper soon because production is moving to China and they have put the EE and some other chips onto 1 chip.

Regards

JAM

No matter how you put it; making the only choice you have, common sense, whatever, it's still an intelligent decision. It will be hard to convince anyone that Microsoft has no marketing intelligence. Just because someone you don't like makes the right decision, doesn't make it not intelligent. Intelligent: Showing sound judgment and rationality. You must admit it was a rational move. I never claimed it was brilliant or genius. ;)


As for it being only one month, would it have been more intelligent to wait 6 months? The intelligent thing to do was to do it as soon as possible. To say they should have introduced X-Box at a lower price, is not neccessarily showing more intelligence. There was no data on which to base this decision. Microsoft has never been in the game console market before, how could they know for certain what the supply and demand curve was for their product in all markets. The X-Box is selling succesfully in the US at a higher price, why not try in Europe? Arm chair quarterbacks will always tell you what play you should have run after the games over. Who that was considering an X-Box before wouldn't buy it now that the price has dropped? This hasn't cost Microsoft a thing (dropping prices never does, only raising prices creates problems).

Because it's got the widest range of games available. Suits ALL ages. Can be chipped. Plays DVDs out of the box and has games such as:



lol,maybe so,but you missing one vital point,nearly all those games are coming out on the x-box in one form or another with extra nuts and bolts added,so anyone buying a ps2 now although yes it does have a larger range of games at present will be selling themselves short in the long run.

Ok you may say that you will be playing these games before i will,but in the end the better version will be on x-box.
Its only the sony exclusives that won't appear,but thats not really a problem as most of the tiles are on ther 3/4/5 incarnation to the scene and have become tiresome.
Also you say that you could list a whole page of PS2 games,you should its been out long enough so at the moment you cannot compare a system is JUST better because it has more games available.

Can play dvd's out of the box,you say,yes but can you save your games?
No, you have to buy a mem card,do i?
Do you have a modem for internet play?
no
Do you have a harddrive to speed up loading times(crash bandicoot being a prime example)
no
Do you have ingame custom made soundtracks?
no
Can i turn my x-box on its side?
no,its a console,not a fashion item!




Also when the ps2 launched at £299 there was no competation so there was no need to drop the price.

and finally the x-box has been cracked to some degree:


The creators of the PS2 modchip neo technologies have now cracked the xbox.

They have enabled JAP / USA and PAL machines to play games from all 3 regions

Macrovision has also been cracked.

Now working on DVD Multiregion.



Its not going to be so easy Sony this time,which again is better for you and me when they design the next big console
:)

I guess its just a case of "time will tell" i hope the xbox does do well as well as the gamecube there is certainly room for 3 consoles in the market.

Competition is something that we all benefit from whichever camp you decide to choose, or all three if your loaded!! lol

Regrards

JAM

1) can the hard drive be taken round to a m8s house and loaded up on his machine?

2) Internet play has not kicked off really on any PS2 and why bundle it with it give the people a choice they by as an extra if they want it.

3) XBOX Hard drive=8Gb
PS2 Hard drive when it becomes available=40+ Gb

4) I've got a £1000 cd player. If I wanted no sound why not ask the developers to skip the special effects. And have no superbly created tunes and atmospheric sound FX.

5) You couldn't lift the breezeblock high enough to even attempt to put it on it's side, it scratches discs at the moment, on it's side it would virtually eat them :)

lol

oh and it doesn't scratch the discs anymore,but hey didn't the ps2 have a dvd prob when it was released which needed a recall of ALL systems in Japan

Lol,why a 40gig?,when a 8gig will do,again paying more for what you
actually really gonna need.............if it get released in the UK at all?
A typical Sony trait.

Why go round my m8's house with the x-box when i can play em over internet?

The option for Custom made music tracks of my own music through my 5.1 dolby digital surround setup ,not everyone likes the in game music supplied by the games developers,the x-box has the option to do this.

Anyway this thread has been good,keep it up Borgy


Back to Halo........

The jap ps2's were recalled because someone found a way of booting any region dvd and sony had to be seen as doing something about it, it was a nice bonus (then) as now we have region x!

JAM

I don't personally think there's room for 3 companies to battle it out, It's always been a fight between two companies, e.g. early 90s, it's been between sega and Nintendo, All kinds of things were released (jaguar, 3do, cdi, neo geo) but flopped considerably.
Then Sony came along, became a battle between it and Nintendo as they became the big two, whilst Sega died.

Now With sony as big as it is, and Microsoft Having the resources and power in it's machine (not to mention the now considerably more appealing price) I can see Nintendo becoming the usless third person with Sony and Microsoft becoming the big two.

Not so good for the traditionalists, (i.e. sega and nintendo being purely gaming companies but suffering at the hands of companies deciding to enter the market)

Still I guess nintendo has a monopoly on the handheld market, and I can see that being it's focal point once the GC dies.

Just my thought.

...yes, let's rip on the X-Box "scratchy disk" problem when ps2s are dying all over the world from cheaply made lasers...you'd think they would have learned from the Playstation...oh wait, maybe they did...after all, it's much better to make consumers buy your console twice than once, eh? :D...

...I don't think anyone should be setting the ps2 up as some sort of shining example of a well-designed system...these are the people who tell you it's fine to place your console on its side...just don't mind the holes burned into your disks :D...

...and who needs a 40 Gb hard-drive? As for why companies shouldn't give people the option of purchasing an option separately...well, that's simple...they don't! Peripherals have never been successful with gaming consoles...unless they start packaging them in with the consoles, the hard-drive is going to run you another $100 or so...hmm, wonder what happens to all of you who already purchased your ps2s without the hard-drive...you think Sony will give you one for free? ;)

jags

Ps2 isn't the best designed system, but the games make up for it. With the large selection of games the ps2 has, everyone is buying that. Its becoming one of those household items. Its a good thing microsoft dropped the price. The xbox is doing poorly in Japan as well. One of the reasons for that is the price. Dropping the price is like almost losing money though. Only time will tell between the systems.

saying who needs 40Gb hard drive is like saying who needs a modem with it and a poxy 8Gb built in hard drive???

40Gb hard drive mean future game downloads,music etc.

You try and fit that on 8Gb ;)


The Hard drive wont be lauched over here at £100 that for sure.

BTW your wrong about GC you wanna see the pre-orders :) much higher than the xbox. It's doing well in all areas of the world.

And Nintendo are the only company that's making the huge profits right now.
This since the GBA and GC launched nintendo has never made the huge profit it has recently that must speak for itself. And with the GC £150 price tag likely to reach £100 by Xmas..... wont fail

8 gigs is more than enough for all of what you mentioned...unless things have changed recently, none of the console makers are planning on releasing entire games online...just bonus features like extra levels, special characters, updated rosters, etc...

How do you know what the hard-drive will launch for in the U.K.? Do you have an insider source no one else has access to or what? ;)

Nintendo's always done reasonably well with their hardware sales...that's a fairly well known fact...but to say it's already making huge profits is nonsense. Nintendo was taking a loss on the hardware just like everyone else. Their loss just happens to be much less than what Microsoft is taking at the moment. I don't know if I would attribute Nintendo's market position at the moment to the GBA and the GC, as much as I would a certain yellow, fuzzy animal-looking thing...;)

jags

Promise's,promises,promises.thats all Sony have.

Remember the hype with the ps2 saying that the if dismantled the chips and stuff could be used to control a missile,so when you hear them say you'll be able to download movies and games and store em on this 40gig harddrive,do you actually believe them?
lol,you more than a idiot than i thought.

But i do give credit to Sony on one matter,they are good at brain washing people into think that their system is the be all and end all of gaming.


I have had a ps2,it was fine whilst i was waiting for the next console,i have the x-box console now.....its better.....and i will get a GC next just for the nintendo exclusive games.

Too stick to one system and totally dismiss anything else as crap just because its NOT Sony is utter madness,and this seems the attitude of the majority of Sony owners.

Already in Australia, Europe (and japan?) was the price drop (an amount of over 2 fifths (!!) = almost half the price) due to its poor selling. that makes the Xbox even cheap (well, cheap...) as the ps2, with the diff PS2 needed about one year to get to this price. The Q is: will it become even more cheaper?

The X-BOX is a waste of space anyway, if i wanted another space chunker i would have brought another video recorder




Poor Xbox sales force Microsoft to cut price
By Charles Arthur, Technology Editor
19 April 2002
Microsoft has slashed the price of its Xbox video games console by a third in Europe and Australia, one month after its launch, in a move that the industry has taken as a sign of disastrously bad sales.

From 26 April the Xbox will cost £199 in Britain, down from £299, a 34 per cent cut. In Europe the price will fall to €299 (£184) from €479, a 38 per cent cut. People who have already bought and registered the machine will receive a "thank you" package of two games and a video controller normally priced at about £115.

The cut puts the Xbox at the same price as Sony's Playstation 2, but industry figures suggest Sony's machine is now outselling the Xbox more than fivefold, despite being 15 months old. The Xbox was launched in Europe last month and had a multimillion-pound marketing push from the Seattle company, better known for its Windows software.

It is the first price cut for the games console, which launched in America last November and in Japan in February. Microsoft has not made price cuts in those regions.

Retailers and analysts welcomed the move, saying it should stoke sales for the Xbox just as demand was waning.

"We are making a clear statement today -- we mean business in Europe," said Sandy Duncan, Vice President, Xbox Europe (not the one who played Peter Pan on Broadway). "The phenomenally positive response to Xbox through reviews, awards and game sales has demonstrated that customers love Xbox. We want to make sure that price is not the obstacle to the Xbox experience."

"This is a long-term, strategic move that will benefit our retail partners, our third-party publishing partners and ultimately the gamer," Duncan went on to say. "The most powerful video game system on earth, and the only one with a built-in hard drive and broadband adapter, is now without a doubt the best value available. The playing field in Europe has been leveled, making it even easier for customers to enjoy the power of Xbox."

Dixons at £199

At our local dixons they are now selling the Xbox for £199 which is before the 26th so it looks like their trying to beat all competition to the price cut. See your local Dixons and see.!! I asked one of the people who worked there and they said they have been given the go-ahead to decrease the price early!

Originally posted by Deforce
yada yada yada...

Retailers and analysts welcomed the move, saying it should stoke sales for the Xbox just as demand was waning.

This is the bottom line of your're entire posts (literally and figuratively).

Originally posted by Borgy
3) XBOX Hard drive=8Gb
PS2 Hard drive when it becomes available=40+ Gb


Wrong:
XBOX Hard drive=8GB (included)
PS2 Vapor drive if and when it becomes available=40+ GB.

By then XBOX may have an 80 GB hard drive. Gamers need hardware, not promises. ;)

Why even begin to argue about the superiority of a device that doesn't even exists, and even if it does materialize you will have to pay for it?

XBOX have an 80Gb hard drive planned?

must be an upgrade then which means more £££££ so basically the 8Gb what comes with the XBOX is a waste of money then??
Would it be external? lol and make it even heavier :)

Originally posted by burp




I went into EB yesterday,they have two full shelves of 2nd hand PS2 games,all the crap titles that kiddies had brought,this is why the ps2 is doing well,it floods the market with crap.





lol, thats is so funny. all of this is so opinionated, some people like the xbox some people like sony ps2. i have a ps2 but that is probably only because i can buy cheap copied games, if money wasnt a prblem i would probably go for the game cube becuase i like the sort of games that are on nintendo consoles. there is no actual answer to which console is the best, its just down to preferences.

Although i did find it funny what you said, how could Sony be doing so well because the flood the market with crap??????? That makes no sense!!!! you do badly if you flood the market with crap. of course there will be crap games on all consoles. Kiddies are more intelligent than you think though, even the little 8 year old are palying top titles like MGS2 etc etc

This thread still going/lol


the real deal is that we all gain from this in the end one way or another which is what really matters.

Originally posted by Borgy
XBOX have an 80Gb hard drive planned?

must be an upgrade then which means more £££££ so basically the 8Gb what comes with the XBOX is a waste of money then??
Would it be external? lol and make it even heavier :)

Now do you see how ridiculous it is to talk about hardware that doesn't even exist yet? :D Talk is cheap, why not announce a 200 GB hard drive is being planned?

BTW, XBOX obviously has room and the capability to put a hard drive inside the box.

Originally posted by geezemarc3000
lol, thats is so funny. all of this is so opinionated, some people like the xbox some people like sony ps2...

In this case it seems that people's anti-Microsoft attitude is the determining factor, not the XBox itself. Strange that Sony should be considered better, when if they had their way you couldn't copy an audio cd, yet alone download an MP3.

same with MS! If they had their way you wouldn't be able to copy Windows etc. It works both ways m8.
BYW I'll find you a link to the PS2 hard drive l8er. :) keymaster we could say you and the rest of people slagging sony off are Anti-Sony.

how can i be anti Sony when i've have brought 5 PS1's and a PS2.
Just because i no longer own them doesn't make me anti Sony.

I now own a Xbox,that doesn't mean i hate Sony,it means i'm a gamer who doesn't dismiss a console just beacause it hasn't Sony written on it.

like Keymaster said
In this case it seems that people's anti-Microsoft attitude is the determining factor, not the XBox itself.

Anti-Sony? I have Sony TVs, VCRs, DVD-ROM, camcorder, telephone answering machine, reciever. I purchased the first Sony XBR TV made, Sony's first 4 head Betamax VCR for $1200, Playstation...

I can't help it if I'm more objective than you Borgy. I buy good products because they are the best I can buy, regardless of whether Sony or Microsoft makes them. I also have never put down the PS1 or PS2. But I'm not like you and going to jump on the Bill Gates bashin wagon, just because he's so successful. I'm just trying to point out to you that your slagging is misplaced.

Does it make you feel bettter to put down Microsoft and claim they are only successful selling Xboxes because they are buying the market. Bill Gates created Microsoft from a dorm room in a quarter of a century. He built his first BASIC interpreter without even owning or having access to the company he sold the product too, by building an emulator for one of Harvard's computer. He didn't buy success and it wasn't given too him, so why be jealous of him?

I own Windows? Which means I'm not anti MS doesn't it?

Well in your case keymaster you prefer MS Over anything sony make. Put it this way if MS made TV's you'd own one ;)

Originally posted by Borgy
I own Windows?

Do you?
or is it a copy
lol

lol, i wonder if MS tv's would have a alt ctrl del on the remote?

JAM

lol,no but ps2 does have a reset button does that count?

Yeah MS TV's could end up freezing on Huggy Bears face when you're in the middle of a Starsky & Hutch and the sound would get jammed on "The word on the street...." and you'd be like frantically pushing buttons in any order or getting real desperate and slamming all the buttons down together before you get a nice big chunky blue screen with a fat old error message.

Actually I only own a PS1. Waiting my time to see which drops nicely in price and which drops totally from view.
It's always like being on one side or the other.
Amiga or Atari
Megadrive or Nintendo
etc blah blah
And I wont even start with that paperweight of an excuse, the Jaguar which you can now buy from EB for £20 I think.
What a 64 bit rush.....

Originally posted by burp
lol,no but ps2 does have a reset button does that count?

Hey that suits me fine after all the reset button tells my messiah if i've put in a cdr or dvdr game lol :D

JAM

Originally posted by Borgy
I own Windows? Which means I'm not anti MS doesn't it?

Well in your case keymaster you prefer MS Over anything sony make. Put it this way if MS made TV's you'd own one ;)

You own Windows and complained about it and how Microsoft could not produce a game console since they can't produce a bug-free OS, remember? If you had any other feasable choice you would certainly use it. Are you trying to suggest that after all the Bill Gates and Microsoft bashing, not to mention the XBox bashing you have posted here, that we are to believe you're not Anti-MS? :laugh:

BTW, even if you had some basis for your claim that I prefer MS over anything, that still doesn't mean I bash other companies and their products without giving them a fair evaluation. I'm sure I've owned and worked with more non-MS OS than you, including developing software as a MAC and OS/2 consultant for almost a decade.

BTW, I've owned two Playstations and no XBox yet. :D And I would buy a MS TV if they made a better one than Sony. If you could say the same you would be considering the purchase of an XBox instead of bashing it. :D

Originally posted by JAMAL
lol, i wonder if MS tv's would have a alt ctrl del on the remote?

JAM

What does this have to do with the XBox. If Sony made (could make) an OS, I guess it wouldn't have ctrl-alt-del and would never hang. Then why haven't they done it, they had deeper pockets than Microsoft when Windows was first launched.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. The XBox should be the subject here not Microsoft or Bill Gates. How can you compare an operating system that must run everyones software, that you have no control over, on everyones hardware that you have no control over, with everyones peripherals components installed, with a closed box that only runs games (software) you approve? Until Sony produces an OS that's as widely used as Windows there is no sense bringng up Microsofts Windows as a measure of their ability to produce a game console.

Sony wouldn't make an operating system because they can make a decent console :) unlike microsoft which seems to have spent to much time with OS :)

Borgy - u actually played the Xbox on a decent system with surround sound? or for more than 5 mins.

I have always bought Sony for the quality, but now Xbox offers next generation games like Halo, PGR, Rallisport and Jetset Radio, all AAA games. It took a year for Sony to have a comparable number of AAA titles like GT3, GTA3, MGS.

I dont give 2 f@@ks who makes the console, as long as it works, i dont give 3 f@@ks whether the ps2 has a harddrive or not, all pepl care about is the quality of the games.

All I know is the best games are coming out on xbox like Panzer Dragoon, MGS X, Shenmue 3, Operation Flashpoint, Turok, Crazy taxi 3 etc etc. i dont know of any new AAA PS2 games coming out, bar Colin MCCree 3 (which ll be better on xbox) dont like FF series, and GT4 is 18 months off.

i ve played 4 xbxox games and im getting one @ £199 on Friday, nuff said.

Borgy, I think you're running out of ammunition now. The last argument is simply childish (where is the logic?). :hdspin:

Sony will make any technical product they can make money on, they make computers (but I would only buy one for my children). And they certainly made a few mistakes with past products (Betamax - trying to monopolize the market).

Its only the games that are keeping the ps2 ahead of the console war AT THE MOMENT.

When the x-box starts getting more and more ps2 conversions,exclusives and pc conversions ect/ect with better graphics ,extra levels and stuff added,and bugs fixed from the ps2 versions then people will see the light.

The ps2 has been out 2 years,so you would expect a large number of peeps to have one,its only logical as there was nothing else out.
The x-box has been only just released people are curious and alot of questions are being asked and a lot of defending that there now OLD system has a new rival and THEY DON'T LIKE IT.
So obvisiouly they are gonna slag of another newer system cos they are childish and afraid that there system will become unsupported,and this is typical of a system that has many users.

Sony did make a big mistake and made the ps2 difficult to program for which maybe its downfall in the end,this may also be why alot of the games are substandard and look hardly any better than there ps1 counterparts.Yes the Big companies can spend years and alot of money on developing a few AAA titles but if they can spend a shorter amount of time and money on a system thats easier to program for they will join the x-box development team eventually.

Sony had their fun against the Saturn/DC/N64,but not this time.

Also we do need the x-box/GC just to keep Sony on its toes,we wouldn't want a monoply of the gaming market would we,? by a single company? :)

Very well put burp. Basically Microsoft has a similar challenge to what Sony faced when they first launched PS1. The doubters claimed that Sony knew nothing about video game consoles and couldn't compete with Nintendo. In addition XBox has to deal with the MS bashers and Bill Gates haters, but the gamers will eventually want the best available console. Until PS3 comes along, it's not made by Sony, like it or not. This is why the XBox bashers (like politicians) constantly try to avoid the issues (they can't win on the issues), and bring up Windows and Bill Gates and monoplies. :D

BTW, is it true that GameCube has lowered prices in response to XBox price drop. How could that be, if the Xbox is a non-factor? I didn't think Nintendo had any room (large enough profit margin) to lower prices. ;)

Who's claimed the GC has lowered in price? I said by Xmas 2002 it will have lowered!

as for PS2 games looking hardly better than the PSone games :) An optician needs to take a look at your eyes m8 ;)

BTW they'll not stick with the xbox m8 these big developers want profit not an easy system to develop for :)

with the xbox their not able to gain maximium profit! and that's a fact.
most of your points are opinionated again. I'm just wiping all the **** off the screen because that's what most of your posts contain :)

Originally posted by Borgy

BTW they'll not stick with the xbox m8 these big developers want profit not an easy system to develop for :)



and how are they gonna get these profits if it takes more time and money to develop them in the 1st place for a very difficult system to program for.

But thats not susch a factor now because they can multi platform the games and add new things to the other consoles,so in affect you will always be getting a substandard version of a game now on PS2 if that game is converted to say X-box or gamecube

Also seeing that you cannot look further than you nose,the gamecube HAS been lowered in price due to microsofts recent price cuts.


Nintendo on Monday cut the price of its GameCube consoles by up to 24 percent in Europe two weeks before launch. GameCube will go on sale in Europe on May 3 for 199 euros ($177), down 20 percent from the earlier announced price of 250 euros, and for 129 pounds ($186.7) in Britain, a 24 percent discount. Nintendo's move follows Microsoft's decision last week to cut the price of its Xbox consoles in Europe, putting it in line with best-selling rival, Sony's PS2, at 299 euros and 199 pounds in Britain.

The GameCube will now retail at 100 euros cheaper than Xbox and PS2 in Europe, although the latter two come with a built-in DVD drive. Nintendo plans to rollout GameCube in Europe in two weeks, initially shipping 500,000 units. The company plans to ship another 500,000 units within the following eight weeks.

Nintendo, which has shipped four million GameCube consoles worldwide, said it made the cut because it felt it could pass on production economies of scale to consumers.

sorry m8! Yep the GC Has been lowered. Very sorry for not having time to check it out what with work only just get enough time to post on here now and again never mind go surfing the web :)

The main (decent) developers will be able to program for the xbox thus excluding the minor developers. MGS2 is a prime example of what can be acheived on the PS2.

If you can develop games twice as fast with the XBox, this reduces your development costs to 1/2. This increases your profit margin substantially. Then you are developing for a console that has a strong game to console ratio. Even with a lower installed base this presents profit opportunities. In addition there is less product available for XBox which provides a less saturated market.

I guess I should also mention that the developers will also see a opportunity to exploit the technological superiority of the XBox, which will showcase (advertise) their game development skills. This will result in additional sales for the game and future games. Since it's the games that matter, this is the tail that wags the dog resulting in stronger future XBox sales.

and now the GC has dropped in price i will buy one of them as well.

Xbox for me and the GC for the kids.

Ps2 doesn't even enter into it now,its in the past.

I'll will get nearly every ps2 game on my x-box/updated and enhanced and i'll get all the nintendo exclusives like the res evil series,ect,ect

so i have no reason to be slightly interest in what the ps2 can offer as it has none now.

Yes I believe PS2 has been outflanked and surrounded. Look for a price drop to pass on lower product costs savings to consumers. :D :laugh: :D :laugh: :D :laugh:

Hiya merc m8!

Hows you doing
Yes its a long thread ain't it,but its one of those seemingly never ending topics.

lol, bet this takes you back Merc! :D

Anyone else catch the Seamus Blackley interview? Very good read there, particularly for those who don't think the X-Box is going to hand around. I try to keep up with all the news whether it be X-Box/GC/PS2 and a lot of the information in there surprised even me...;)

best,
jags

hee hee just got my xbox for £200- verdict - ps2 killer. I think its wicked value for money, with the h/d for music and saves.

i can play my own mp3s burnt to wav on cdrw (not cdrs) on Project Gotham and Rallisport Challenge.

the graphics on pgr, halo and wreckless are practically photorealistic, unlike my dusty ps2.

the sound, through the advanced av cable and 5.1 system is superb, 3d sound and has in game effects unlike ps2.

and the controller is just a fat version of the dcs. no probs, unless your an 8 year old kid/Jeremy Beadle lol!!

the only prob is the cost of games, got mine for around 28-30 second hand on ebay/yahoo, someone must be able to chip it.

If the sounds so good in game then why play your audio over the top ;)

also xbox and 10 games must cost about £600

Ps2 and 10 games = £300+

aren't chipped consoles good...

grow up Borgy,who give a **** if your ps2 is chipped your only in the "scene" cos the games can be copied.

your only defending the ps2 for one reason only...cheap copied crap games....

Hi Burp. Getting annoyed are you????

Again this is consumers opinions!! NOT JUST YOURS!!!!!!!!!!

can never understand people who actually slag other people off for no reason, get a life m8.

:laugh:

no i'm not annoyed,but it does seem as if you need to get the last word in all the time like a 10yr old would,so whats your problem then?

i hear the ps2 MAY be dropping its price to £129 to match the gamecube real soon.........hope you enjoy receiving your free games and controller.
OH
Your not getting any?
Well never mind m8,WE all know Sony don't give a **** about there customers.

Roll on ps3

Borgy
why do i play my tunes over the top, lol? wouldnt you want to play your tunes in game, as you cant do on ps2? many game soundtracks are not my cup of tea, especially with american rock, lol, xbox lets u make your own choice :-))

id rather have 5 original games for £140, then trade or sell when ive finished em, rather than 70 - 140 ps2 games, 5 of which are any good. ie mgs2, gta3, gt3, devil may cry and sh2. and most of those are on dvdr so u have to pay £8-12 each anyway double lol.

seeing as sony makes a loss on the hardware, youre ripping off your idol company, every time you buy a ripped game.

why dont u hire an xbox for a weekend, with halo, pgr, jetsetradio future, and doa3 and make an informed decision? me thinks hating ms is more important for u non?

Good point dark, I don't think anyone needs to be slagging one console or another without some substantial playing time with it to back up their objections. I've had all 3 of the consoles at one time or another (currently I have my X-Box and PS2) and there were things I loved about all of them. I just happen to enjoy my time playing the X-Box more than playing the other consoles. If you want to knock on it for being big or having uncomfortable controllers or no RPGs, whatever...fine, then I think you have a leg to stand on...bashing Micosoft and Bill Gates, as Keymaster has noted time and time again (among others ;)), is not only pointless to the discussion...it's also very foolish given Sony's business practices (which are at the very least as "devious and despicable" as what M$ may be doing)...how about this? Next time you want to express your opinion here regarding X-Box, PS2, GC, whatever...you actually let us know WHY you don't like it and give us examples/facts to back up your opinion...sound reasonable to you?


jags

lol, I agree with ya' there Merc...personally I like the X-Box controller myself since it reminds me a lot of the DC controller...but I will acknowledge those that think there's a bit too much plastic on it as it's definitely much bigger than either the Dual Shock or GC controller...the one gripe I would make would be the placement of the face buttons, which do seem a bit too close together...I'm dying to check out the S-Controller just to see if it feels that much better...:D I'm also with ya' on Spidey...that game is simply Amazing!!! (no that wasn't a cheesy comic book joke!)

I know it was turned into a big joke, but I think the question has some real relevance here..."Can't we all just get along?" Seriously, if you're starting one of these PS2/X-Box/GC posts just to rip on one console or another, well...there are much more important things you should be doing with your time ;)...if you're starting a post just b/c you're curious what others think I think that's great. I know that was my intent when I started a few of these myself...there's no harm in saying something like, "man, the xbox has a hard-drive, I wish the ps2 would have come standard with one..." just as there's nothing wrong with saying, "I'm interested in xbox, but ps2 has so many more games, many of which I don't know that I'll ever see on the xbox!" Now you've got yourself a discussion! But...those people that post xbox sucks b/c Bill Gates owns M$ and Sony sucks b/c of etc, etc...really aren't adding anything to the discussion. And let's be honest here, there have been much more of these comments made on this forum concerning M$ than there have regarding Sony...

Both of these consoles are going to be around for a while. I just recently sat down with my ps2 (today in fact) and played games like GTA3, GT3, MGS2, and FF X...and the only thing that did (besides tick off my fiance) was make me realize how glad I am that I have both of these consoles right now so I get my "fix" when it comes to all my favorite games. I'm still not going to waver...X-Box is my fav...for several reasons...but you'll never hear me say that ps2 sucks or that I hate it b/c I dislike their President/CEO/Whatever ;)...so lets hear it guys who prefer the ps2...why so? Just curious to hear what you think :D


best,
jags

just got my Gamecube today to sit along side the xbox(infact i've put it on top/lol)

4 games
star wars rouge leader
wave racer
luigi mansion
Super Monkey ball
extra official controller
scart mem card

my gaming is now complete

use the force Luke!

:)